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Hello,

A new Fan Input Discussion Thread has been opened for the period ending 7 Sep 2010. Please visit the discussion here, and render opinions regarding a possible AToW expansion product.

Thank you...
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3025-3050 Faction Assignment & Rarity Tables - 3050 & 3057 Talk

EDIT 30 July: formatting tweaks, TR3085 Quirks.  See post 351 on page 11 for details.

If you're just looking for Battleforce values, please skip to the bottom of this post, to Extras #2.

Please check back on occasion for updates; I'll keep the thread title updated with the date of the last changes.


CONTENTS:
 - random mech and vehicle assignment tables by faction for 3028, 3039, and 3050
 - a rarity guide
 - Quirks

OVERVIEW:
I decided I needed new random assignment tables, since the ones on the website and in Combat Operations are out of date and in general a little lacking as far as I was concerned (not to knock the work that must have gone into them: god after redoing mine about 5000 times I understand that all too well).

My faction tables date to 3028 (on the eve of the 4th Succession War), to 3039 (at the opening of the War of 3039), and to 3050 (Clan tables covering the initial invasion through to Tukayyid).  ALL machines appropriate to the eras that have been published in an official Battletech book are here, along with every single published variant.  Also included are a pair of tables providing Quirks (as found in Strategic Operations).

THE TABLES:
The tables differ from Peter LaCasse's excellent examples in that mine use newer source material, provide an optional random element, and make allowances for rarity and unit quality.  I've made different choices than Peter did as to who gets what, but that's a matter of opinion and design philosophy: feel free to discuss.

At this time they only cover from the late 3rd/early 4th Succession Wars to 3050 (though 3055 tables are coming).  I’ll like to eventually do even later eras, but each is exponentionally harder than the last (and so slower in arriving) due to a lack of info on exactly how the new designs of an era replace older ones phased out, destroyed, or no longer in production, as well as there being less info on modern eras in general.  In addition, my work with the MUL Team eats up most of my free time I have available for Battletech.

The tables all use 3D10 percentile (aka D1000), and are ranked according to Battle Value v2, so a low roll gets you a low-BV model.  As such, rolling high won't necessarily get you the heaviest machine, but it should get you a better one.

I've also created an availability ranking system based on the fluff, so you can at last have an idea of not just what's available, but how common it is.  I rated each machine’s availability on a ten-point scale.  The scale is only meant to represent how common that particular unit is within both its weight class and the force(s) it serves with.  It is not meant to give an accurate picture of total numbers produced or in service in all factions - besides the fact that hard production numbers are almost never found, different weight classes have different deployment ratios.  Variants are rated too.

If a machine is not listed with a faction it’s not to say that that machine cannot be found there at all, but rather that there is no significant amount and no native supply.  Ultimately in the chaos of the Succession Wars it’s perfectly feasible to see at least one of any machine in the ranks of any faction, but these tables merely attempt to depict typical native deployments.  I felt otherwise you might as well just place every machine in every faction, which seems to me to be a rather dull way to handle it.  See the pdf for a more detailed explanation on these sorts of issues.

If you’re going to print it, know that it’s in Landscape format (the sideways layout used in the Technical Readouts) rather than Portrait/Standard.

DOWNLOAD:
It's a 68-page PDF (2,696 KB) hosted here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/357573/3028-3050%20Faction%20Assignment%20%26%20Rarity%20Tables%207.95.pdf


EXTRAS:
#1) BigDuke66 has created an excellent tool that includes a random mech generator and the ability to creating random forces based on faction, era, and unit quality using the data from my charts.  Want to generate an entire regiment at once?  Now you can.  It also takes my D1000 random deployment tables and, through graphs in Microsoft Excel, provides a clear visual representation of them for every single faction.  Strongly recommended.

Mechs
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/357573/3028-3050%20Faction%20Assignment%20%26%20Rarity%20Tables%207.95%20MECHS.xlsx

Vehicles
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/357573/3028-3050%20Faction%20Assignment%20%26%20Rarity%20Tables%207.95%20VEHICLES.xlsx


#2) A colossal effort on the part of nckestrel, this link leads to sheets containing the most up-to-date Battleforce values available anywhere, for almost every unit ever.  Until the MUL comes out this is the best there is.

http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=56488.0


#3) Previous (closed) thread for this project: http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,34933.0.html


I would greatly appreciate feedback on anything: typos, missing elements, disagreements on who got what or how much of it, etc.  If you want to reuse any of this work in another work, feel free to - I just ask that you provide a link back to this thread as credit.  If you find a use for this, please bump the thread.

Special thanks goes to BigDuke66, Frabby, Matti, and nckestrel for help and fact-checking above and beyond the call of duty.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

Okay, so here's what new in v6.0:

-   added the following new Faction tables:

Magistracy 3028-3039
Outworlds 3028-3039
Periphery/Mercenary General 3028-3039
Taurian 3028-3039


-   Added a new Lance Weight Distribution table to the collection of tables on page 2.  It follows the formatting of one in Total Warfare (pg. 265), except that I’ve converted it to the D10 distribution the rest of my charts use, for the sake of consistency.
-   Added Valkyrie and Enforcer to the Lyran 3028 tables at Av 3, based on 4th Succession War Atlas info.  Thanks BigDuke for continued prompting.
-   Raised Valkyrie and Enforcer Lyran 3039 Av’s from 3 to 5.
-   Removed all -8Z Panthers.
-   Corrected Cronus -3M variant model ref from CNS to CRS, as per Masters of the Universe reply.
-   Minor formatting changes.

I finally stopped relying on just my memory and decided to check out the 4th Succession War Atlas on the Lyran Lightning Companies.  It turns out that almost every front-line regiment had one.  Even we assume that in this context "front-line" only referred to the regiments allocated to the Kuritan invasion, that's still about 30 regiments.  Dividing the Lightning Company mechs evenly amongst Enforcers, Valkyries, and Hatchetmen still gives a fair number of Davion mechs in Lyran service, enough to qualify for Av 3.  This also means that their Lyran 3039 numbers needed to be increased to compensate for the fact that there already were 120 or so of each before you add in the extra post-war production.

There are no separate Periphery Av numbers yet, but in general I made the rare stuff rarer, while shifting weight towards the lower-end of the BV scale.

Stuff I'm Looking For:
 - nckestral: would you mind letting me know here what settings have to be enabled in Excel  (VB, macros, whatever) to ensure one doesn't get NAME errors, so I can add that info to the first post?  Thanks.
 - can anyone with the Major Periphery States pdf tell me if there's any major info on mech production?  I'm especially interested in info on Taurian Commandos.
 - any specific mention of mech models or variants being common in mercenary units or the Periphery.
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Lieutenant
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

Been flipping through HB:MPS. A few bits and pieces of info, limited to stuff regarding 'Mechs:

The Magistracy Armed Forces have been the second-largest 'Mech force in the Periphery. They are organized by the standard 4-3-3 pattern.
Major Canopian military industries:
- Majesty Metals And Manufacturing on Canopus IV (Locust, Stinger, Wasp, Marauder) and on Dunianshire (Shadow Hawk, Locust), sole source of Canopian armaments for a time (existing since 2800)
- Detroit Consolidated Mechworks on Detroit (Anubus, Stinger, Ostroc, Marshal, Wasp), joint Canopian/Taurian facility built with Capellan help, completed in 3060

Taurian Defence Forces organized in 4-3-4 pattern ('Mech units).
Major Taurian military industries:
- Taurian Territorial Industries on Taurus (Thunderbolt, Warhammer, Marauder, Marshal, Locust, Wasp). In the 3060, is building a Wasp under license from the CapCon (probably referring to a licensed variant?) and has recently been selling significant numbers of Thunderbolts and Warhammers to the Outworlds Alliance.
- Vandenburg Mechanized Industries on New Vandenburg (Marauder, Archer, Stinger, Ostroc), on Pinard (Thunderbolt, Warhammer) and on Illiushin (Shadow Hawk, Stinger, Commando, Griffin)
- Pinard Protectorates Ltd. on Pinard (Marauder), MacLeod's Land (Clint, Locust, Stinger), Perdition (Wasp), formed in 3020

Outworlds Alliance only had some 3 BattleMech regiments in total until 3056, and heavily relied on mercenaries whenever needed.
- Alliance Defenders Limited on Alpheratz (Locust, Stinger, Wasp) was the sole BattleMech manufacturer from 2750 to after 3056.
- Mountain Wolf BattleMechs subsidiary on Alpheratz (main HQ on Vendrell in Lyran space) was abandoned 2945 after Vendrell HQ's destruction by Marik forces. Slowly reactivated in early 31st century producing the Merlin and since 3063 also the Night Hawk.

Marian Hegemony, Circinus Federation, Rim Collection: No domestic 'Mech production.

To answer your question, nothing is said at all about Taurian Commandos besides them being built on Illiushin. The production lists are as of 3067, but do not indicate any sub-variant or tech level of 'Mech being built, only the basic frame.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

tagged
M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

It's up: have at it!
M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

Tools, Add-ins and check the Analysis Toolpak option.  (Specifically this enables the randbetween function that is used for all the dice rolling and therefore all results are based on).
If you have #NAME's with that on, then yell at me.

.


M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

I think there's a typo in the TC Assault mech table.
Taurian Concordant has a lot of CP-10-Qs?  (529-800)
And the STK-3F is only 526-528?
I think the STK-3F end number is a typo and is supposed to be 797 like the other periphery states. leaving the CP-10-Q as only 798-800?
M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

I think there's a typo in the TC Assault mech table.
Taurian Concordant has a lot of CP-10-Qs?  (529-800)
And the STK-3F is only 526-528?
I think the STK-3F end number is a typo and is supposed to be 797 like the other periphery states. leaving the CP-10-Q as only 798-800?

Oops, yeah - the proper values should be:

492-525   STK-4N Stalker [85]
526-797   STK-3F Stalker [85]
798-800   CP-10-Q Cyclops [90]
801-807   AWS-8T Awesome [80]

I'll do a silent update later today.  If you redownload it tomorrow you'll have the fix.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

http://files.getdropbox.com/u/660303/Battleforce%20v2.10.xls
updated to use v6.0 of Xotl's distribution charts.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

We got another one.
Canopus seems to be missing a line:
1-50 Salvage: Marik
101-302 STG-3R Stinger [20]

Were is 51 to 100?
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - June 29 v6.0

We got another one.
Canopus seems to be missing a line:
1-50 Salvage: Marik
101-302 STG-3R Stinger [20]

Were is 51 to 100?

Oops again.  There's nothing missing; I accidentally put 100 in as a salvage amount for that column, rather than the 50 I should have.

That chart should read:

001-050   Salvage: Marik
051-264   STG-3R Stinger [20]
265-512   WSP-1A Wasp [20]
513-701   LCT-1V Locust [20]
702-741   LCT-3V Locust [20]
742-776   STG-3G Stinger [20]
777-850   UM-R60 Urbanmech [30]
851-870   LCT-1E Locust [20]
871-887   JVN-10N Javelin [30]
888-897   OTT-7J Ostscout [30]
898-902   HER-1A Hermes [30]
903-907   FLC-4N Falcon [30]
908-917   SDR-5V Spider [30]
918-987   FS9-H Firestarter [35]
988-992   MON-67 Mongoose [25]
993-997   FS9-K Firestarter [35]
998-000   JVN-10F Javelin [30]

Thanks as always Duke.


EDIT: corrected the two chart errors, added Gladiator mech to the Periphery/Mercenary table.  6.1 is up.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

http://files.getdropbox.com/u/660303/Battleforce%20v2.11.xls
updated tables to Xotls 6.1
added JHS3076 mechs/vehicles BF stats
working on Solaris mechs.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Wouldn't it make more sense for the periphery to have more salvage than a great house to make up its military?

EDIT:  That sounds confusing.  Better phrasing:  wouldn't salvage make up a higher proportion of a Periphery military than a Great House's?
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Thanks for the update Xotl. How's the 3055 table going? Smiley

BYE
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

This is groovy as always  Afro!  CGL has to put Xotl on the payroll! Rock On
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Now the PERIPHERY/MERCENARY GENERAL charts.  Is that for mercenaries in the Periphery?  Or, both general Periphery, and general mercenary,  just both using the same chart?
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

http://files.getdropbox.com/u/660303/Battleforce%20v2.11.xls
updated tables to Xotls 6.1
added JHS3076 mechs/vehicles BF stats
working on Solaris mechs.

Thanks as always, and looking forward to the new stuff.

Wouldn't it make more sense for the periphery to have more salvage than a great house to make up its military?

EDIT:  That sounds confusing.  Better phrasing:  wouldn't salvage make up a higher proportion of a Periphery military than a Great House's?

I don't believe so.  Remember: they have much, much smaller mech forces than their Great House neighbors.  Would they have crappier mechs?  Yes.  Would they have more mechs in bad shape?  I believe so.  However, they have all had far fewer armed conflicts with the Houses, so the opportunities for salvaging in the first place would be markedly fewer, IMHO. 

Thanks for the update Xotl. How's the 3055 table going? Smiley

Thanks for asking.  Slowly - don't expect anything for a month or so, as I'm working two jobs this summer and running a Battletech/Mechwarrior game, so time is short.

Now the PERIPHERY/MERCENARY GENERAL charts.  Is that for mercenaries in the Periphery?  Or, both general Periphery, and general mercenary,  just both using the same chart?

The intent was for both general mercenary and general Periphery to use the same chart.  For 3055 these two will be separated.

Thanks for the interest all.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Does anyone know where to find a translation of the H:Wo39 equipment ratings(A*, A, B, C) to the FM series ratings(A, B, C, D, F)?
I could swear I saw that already somewhere but I just can't find it anymore.
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Thanks for asking. Slowly - don't expect anything for a month or so, as I'm working two jobs this summer and running a Battletech/Mechwarrior game, so time is short.

Hey, no rush. It's not like you owe us anything. More like we owe you something for doing these. They're great. Smiley

BYE
M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Does anyone know where to find a translation of the H:Wo39 equipment ratings(A*, A, B, C) to the FM series ratings(A, B, C, D, F)?
I could swear I saw that already somewhere but I just can't find it anymore.

I've never seen this, but offhand I'd just do this:

A* --> A
A  --> B
B  --> C, D
C  --> F

The Historical ratings are odd because they have no entry for "average".
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Thanks.
Thought I found something but the SO p. 168 equipment rating table doesn't show anything for the H:Wo39, I asked the writers already.


So now that we have more Valkyries, Enforcers & Hatchetman in to give credit to the Lightning companies I thought that maybe a slight tuning of the REGIONAL WEIGHT DISTRIBUTION would be good.
If we say that all house Steiner mech regiments get 1 extra company of light/medium mechs in the average then a little bit more on the light/medium and a little less on the heavy/assault should reflect that.
I thought about:
Light 23%(from 20%)
Medium 32%(from 30%)
Heavy 28%(from 30%)
Assault 17%(from 20%)
How about that?
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Lieutenant
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

I don't believe so.  Remember: they have much, much smaller mech forces than their Great House neighbors.  Also, they have all had far fewer armed conflicts with the Houses, so the opportunities for salvaging in the first place would be markedly fewer, IMHO.

Maybe only for the Marian hegemony? The new periphery book mentions that the Marians depend heavily from salvage to acquire their mech forces...
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

[fragged and bagged - tagging for future reference]
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Nice munchy stuff
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

@Xotl
In the quirk list entries for the Dragon (Grand) and Hermes III are missing.
I guess the Grand Dragon runs under Dragon but we have one entry for Hermes and one for Hermes II so I guess one for Hermes III is missing or?
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Tools, Add-ins and check the Analysis Toolpak option.  (Specifically this enables the randbetween function that is used for all the dice rolling and therefore all results are based on).
If you have #NAME's with that on, then yell at me.

Activated the add-ons, still have #name errors (ZUFALLSBEREICH) in the random mech generator tab.  The add-ons fixed the same errors in the separate Battleforce sheet.

These sheets are awesome, thanks!
M.U.L. Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

I think Vorpal is talking about BigDuke's spreadsheet.
Random Mech Generator tab has ZUFALLSBEREICH in cell A5.  That should be randbetween in English.  Don't know if ZUFALLSBEREICH is something in another language and would work if my Excel knew German, or what.
The 2007 version appears fine to me.  It has randbetween and it works.
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Warrant Officer
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Last of the Wilds

Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Is he using an older excel version?
I only have 2007 and so can't test the sheet with an older excel version.
2007 lets you save in the old format and you can work with 2007 on them but that doesn't mean that they would work without problems when using an older version.
Hopefully someone get track the problem down as I can't see any error in the old and new format files.
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Catalyst Demo Team
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The Peace of Blake goes Snicker-Snack!

Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Is he using an older excel version?
I only have 2007 and so can't test the sheet with an older excel version.
2007 lets you save in the old format and you can work with 2007 on them but that doesn't mean that they would work without problems when using an older version.
Hopefully someone get track the problem down as I can't see any error in the old and new format files.

i am using excel 2003
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Catalyst Demo Team
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

I think Vorpal is talking about BigDuke's spreadsheet.
Random Mech Generator tab has ZUFALLSBEREICH in cell A5.  That should be randbetween in English.  Don't know if ZUFALLSBEREICH is something in another language and would work if my Excel knew German, or what.
The 2007 version appears fine to me.  It has randbetween and it works.

yes, Big Duke's spreadsheet, sorry for not being more specific, weird that my version of excel 2003 has the field in german?
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Warrant Officer
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

Weird indeed...
Sure you didn't change anyhting?
Maybe you should download again an see if it happens there too.
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Warrant Officer
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Re: 3025-3039 Faction & Rarity Tables w/ BattleForce - July 1 v6.1

OK lets try to track this down.
Error is on the sheet "Random Mech Generator" in the field A5 or?
The function I use there is:
=ZUFALLSBEREICH(0;1000)

Replace it with this and see if it works now:
=RANDBETWEEN(0;1000)
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